Author Topic: Tik Monster  (Read 8200 times)

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Offline barb (Fry)

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #30 on: August 13, 2008, 09:38:01 PM »
Sandy as I was going to say,
OMG, so sad to see the wasted potential but as Amy Winehouses' mother says, Tough Love is the approach. 
Her dad obviously has a different approach, has he been successful, I don't think so.

My heart wrenches at the possibility of having to deal with this.

So far so good, here by the grace of god go I

When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. Jimi Hendrix

Clive Symes

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #31 on: August 13, 2008, 09:38:40 PM »
Sandy,
Every Monday night sees me at a meeting, where we have a support group for family and friends of addicts. Its also good to see that there are those, that, with help are able to function again.
It seems once they are able to gain a sponsor or become one themselves they gain some self esteem and it does them good

Offline barb (Fry)

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #32 on: August 13, 2008, 09:42:32 PM »
Clive, 
bravo.

So the support for family and friends extends eventually to the addict
fantastic.
When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. Jimi Hendrix

Clive Symes

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #33 on: August 13, 2008, 09:51:03 PM »
It all revolves round the addict, because if they did not have the disease of addiction, we hope we wouldnt need to put ourselves back together again.
Nar Anon ( Narcotics Anonymous) and the associated family groups meet world wide and have similar style meetings in most citys.

Offline georg ruf jr.

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #34 on: August 14, 2008, 10:21:46 AM »
THat's the aid I was meaning Clive. The support the people need is to let them know they're not alone and they're wanted.
Nothing special. Just some clips I put in youtube.de
http://de.youtube.com/results?search_query=bigbug74&search_type=&aq=f
Please comment! It may help promote our volleyball-club.
Skype: bigbug74

Offline Bertie Horak

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #35 on: August 14, 2008, 10:48:04 AM »
So right Georg.  Without a feeling of belonging and worth, it would be very difficult to change oneself for the better, the mind would not just make that decision without some kind of support.  The spiral downwards is much easier than the steps to the top!
Oranjemund 1965-1982.

Offline georg ruf jr.

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #36 on: August 14, 2008, 10:56:30 AM »
Many helpers misunderstand what is meant with aid. They ofen end up "helping" the addict to be an addict. I must try and find the right English words and way of explaining. Been keeping this topic on mind for a long time now...
Nothing special. Just some clips I put in youtube.de
http://de.youtube.com/results?search_query=bigbug74&search_type=&aq=f
Please comment! It may help promote our volleyball-club.
Skype: bigbug74

Offline Delia

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #37 on: August 14, 2008, 03:35:06 PM »
Take it from someone who knows - there's no helping somebody who doesn't want to help themselves.  All you can do as a friend/family member is look after yourself so you don't get sucked into the vortex of destruction along with the addict. Those ties are so strong it takes all your focus to distance yourself from their destructive behaviour.

Clive - the meetings you go to - they're brilliant - really help the family understand a lot of crucial issues when it comes to dealing with an addict - the most important being what you mentioned earlier about understanding the three C's. When i first got to cape town in '95, NarAnon wasn't around in our area yet so i went to the Al Anon meetings for family members (works on  the same principles as NarAnon, 12 step programme, etc, after all an addiction's an addiction, whether it's drugs or alcohol) - my ex was way down that deep dark hole of addiction - i needed to bring the splintered pieces of myself back together to be able to be a wholesome mother to my daughter - i was going through divorce proceedings at the time - i wasn't prepared to live like that any longer and expose my daughter to that type of lifestyle - i'll never forget what one woman said to me - at the time she was about 50+ - she said "Delia, I wish i'd had your courage at your age to divorce my husband and start a new life for myself, he's still drinking after all these years, i've been coming here for 10 years + and nothing's changed, now i look back and see all the years i've wasted on him, years that i can never reclaim for myself"..........

I'll always be grateful for those meetings and the people there that helped and supported me thru a really tough time.  I  struggled tho' to accept the fact that they're happy to just carry on living with their husbands/wives who were addicts and just accept their behaviour - personally i couldn't do it. Different strokes for different folks.
The quality of your life is determined by the quality of your thinking.
"Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional" - Dalai Lama

Offline DUNJA WRBKA

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #38 on: August 14, 2008, 06:51:42 PM »
 congrats  Good on you Delia!  dawoman 

Wish my mother had the courage to have done that much earlier too.  Too many years as a child having to watch the distructive behavour most certainly has had an impact on my life as an adult today.
Don't sweat the small shit!

Offline SandyB

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #39 on: August 14, 2008, 10:00:40 PM »
Again  all well put together and empathetic  viewpoints also putting the emphasis on self preservation ... My hairdresser is a user .. his partner is a co-dependent . sure the " addiction" is "controlled "  vis he now off hard stuff now only doing dope  ( he got onto mandrax years ago  and then managed to get off ) .. but will  drink himself silly as part of the compensation  for his addictive personality ...  such a waste of  potential .. he a talented and creative person but has sold himself short ... furthermore he  has not yet " grown up ' despite heading for 40 .. I dread to think what he will do if Peter passes on .. and  that is a possibility as he is much older .. 70 in fact .. that I have discussed in earnest with him .. the other part well ..we all as  friends tried over the years .. the thank goodness  is he although not clean  at least has reached some sort of slow decrease in usage .. difficult i can imagine  and its not my place to judge ..
To see  sometimes  requires that you  first believe .

Offline Dalene Steenkamp (Coetzee)

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #40 on: August 14, 2008, 11:08:39 PM »
Like you say, Delia  -  diffirent strokes......

My personal opinion about it is that it may be noble to stay with such an addict, maybe for the purpose of support or love  -  I truly don't know, but mostly the person who tries to stick it out gets dragged down emotionally to such a low level of self esteem and sometimes they even get to addicts themselves.  Some people may see it as being selfish to divorce or to walk out of a relationship or partnership where behaviour is destructive for one or all involved.  I think it takes courage.  Like you Delia, you got to a point where you realized that nothing good is going to come out of it for you or your kids or even for your ex, so you made the choise that was best for you.  And I am sure you do not regret that choise today. 
Life becomes harder for us when we live for others, but it also becomes richer and happier. Friendship is a sheltering tree.

To be clever enough to get a great deal of money, one must be stupid enough to want it.

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Offline Delia

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #41 on: August 15, 2008, 02:41:43 PM »
Thank you Dunja for your kinds words - i thought i was going to get shot down by some with my viewsas i know it's a touchy subject. 

Dalene - yes, looking back i have no regrets about the choice i made back then.  because i didn't grow up in an "addict" household i never knew how bad it could actually get and one lives in continual hope that this is the last, it cannot get any worse until it does again and again and again..............  even after i divorced him i still thought "did i do the right thing, maybe he will change" - it was a risk i had to take - then again, we have to sometimes take these risks otherwise how do we ever move on in life - there are no guarantees in any area of life..........caryn was 13 months old when i left him and looking back now (we're all Einstein with hindsight), it was the best thing i ever did.......he's further down that dark hole than ever and i think to myself "where would i be if i didn't divorce him, down there with him?"  caryn's a happy, healthy, well adjusted teenager today and i dread to think what the effects would've been on her if i didn't get out of there when i did.  It's not as tho' i didn't try to help him - too long and involved to go into those details, but as you said Dalene, there comes a point where you just know that you're fighting a losing battle.  One can only try so much to help someone else, the rest is up to them. 

The self esteem issue - i remember when caryn and i arrived in cape town straight after leaving him, my sister-in-law said to me i was like a shell with all the life sucked out of me - so far removed from my normal confident happy self how they knew me.  Thank God over the years I have regained that sense of self and am back to who i was self esteem wise even tho' something like that does change your outlook to a certain degree - it leaves soul scars - but i chose to let the experience make me and not break me.  Addicts are devious and brilliant manipulators - you don't even know you're being manipulated by them until someone pulls you back from the situation to look at it objectively. All said and done, bottom line, my driving force to get out of there was caryn - she deserved more out of life than living in a dysfunctional addictive home with a continual black mood of the addict when he couldn't get his fix.  A friend once said something to me that i'll never forget which helped tremendously with the guilt issue of "breaking up our family", she said: "it's better to come from a broken home than live in one".

with my belief systems in life that in every encounter there's a lesson to be learnt - the lesson my ex taught me?  never to get involved again with anyone who shows the slightest dependancy on alcohol or drugs...........i'll run so fast, my feet won't touch ground.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2008, 02:55:34 PM by Delia »
The quality of your life is determined by the quality of your thinking.
"Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional" - Dalai Lama

Offline SandyB

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #42 on: August 15, 2008, 09:57:50 PM »
Delia .. good  honest words . with any life situation .. yes we must ahve empathy and hope  or else  we may too early throw out something that was possibly  redeemable  but then also a good sense of self preservation  to not allow it to become a habit of co- dependency  and also not subscribe to the  societal baggage of guilt that  so many do  to the point of wandering where they went wrong whereas the responsibility of the situation lay with the dysfunctional one .. and No nobody on this site would judge or blow you out of the water for your openness .. you know in the depth of your heart that at least you tried till you saw no hope .. then you did the inevitable  with a good end result and thats all that matters ..
To see  sometimes  requires that you  first believe .

Clive Symes

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #43 on: August 17, 2008, 06:34:04 PM »
Delia,
If we are able to help only one person to be open about addiction ( what ever the drug/ drink etc of choice is) it starts a whole process acting, and and opens peoples eyes albeit slowly to the possibility of change.

From experience & friends, I now the decision to divorce or end a long term relationship, because of something like this, is so much more difficult once there are children in the relationship, a bit easier when there isn't, but not much.
Sometimes years later when looking back, you know it was the right thing to do.
Depending on the addict left behind, he or she may spiral right the way down or may eventually see themselves for the person they have become .
Some do realize that they do need to change and can with help reform their lives.
When that happens and they do become sober /drug free, we often see them taking up the banner to help and sponser other addicts, putting back into the organization their first hand knowlage.
and that is a tribute to them.
Unfortunatly not all of those who try to regain, sobriaty or free themselves from addiction make it, and that is the tragic nature of the disease of addiction
 

Offline georg ruf jr.

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Re: Tik Monster
« Reply #44 on: August 19, 2008, 12:05:07 PM »
I think only about 20 to 30% of all adicts get cured.
Nothing special. Just some clips I put in youtube.de
http://de.youtube.com/results?search_query=bigbug74&search_type=&aq=f
Please comment! It may help promote our volleyball-club.
Skype: bigbug74