Rape in Oranjemund!

[Carl Wrbka]

Do you remember that woman in Germany a few years ago? During the trial of the rapist who had raped and killed her small daughter, she pulls out a gun in court and empties the magazine into the bastard.

[Michael Alexander]

...and what happened to the mother?

[georgswa (Georg Ruf) (RIP)]

That was on TV the other day, Name Bachmeier

She had a relative mild sentence.

6 years and released after 3 Years

Some years later she died of cancer

Here an article about it

http://suche.aol.de/aol/redir?src=websearch&requestId=bde188e481343760&clickedItemRank=1&userQuery=Bachmeier&clickedItemURN=http%3A%2F%2Fde.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FMarianne_Bachmeier&title=Marianne+%3Cb%3EBachmeier%3C%2Fb%3E+%E2%80%93+Wikipedia&moduleId=matchingsites.jsp.M&clickedItemPageRanking=1&clickedItemPage=1&clickedItemDescription=WebResults

[Carl Wrbka]

She was arrested at the scene and eventually ended up doing time in prison. Maybe the two Georg's could help out with more info. I think her name was Marianne something or other.

[Michael Alexander]

Makes me angry that... her life ruined because of a murdering pervert..... .... 

[Carl Wrbka]

The worst part was that he was a repeat offender who had already had run ins with the law before, and had been deemed safe to live among normal people again.

[Michael Alexander]

Jnr..... here's your cue......

[georg ruf jr.]

Sorry guys, but to me it looks like revenge. Revenge brings new anger and violance. Look at Isreal and Palastine. The keep revenging murder.
I believe forensic is more complecated. Humanity is something so important. It gets me to look at things from all side. As I said before, we are all victoms in a way. This is no excuse for murder. It just doesn't help anybody if you act revenge. Nobody!! Sorry. I'm short of time. Then I don't think any of us will ever be able to close the subject down.

[Florrie van Zyl (Muir)]

Hey Florrie, Did you ever watch that Tom Hanks movie, the one where he lands up alone on a tropical island? Why on earth did he want to leave it.... that place was beautiful and crime free....... I often think of that movie.... just cannot remember the name right now.....

Hi Mike, I could live on a deserted island but I would want my hubby and kids with me. I often think about the book where the whole family get shipwrecked, I think my family are very good at improvising and we would make excellent "shipwreckees", can't find the right word. I am not a TV fan and have practically stopped reading the papers too. Decided not to buy the Sunday Times anymore because they fired David Bullard.  I honestly think that because I am an introvert and enjoy peace and quiet, a deserted island would suit me perfectly.

[Florrie van Zyl (Muir)]

Hey guys! Are you talking about justice or revenge? Do you want to confront the world of hate with hate, or do you want it to be a safe place?

Georg, you are a better person than me. I will have so much hate in me if someone did something to one of my children,  I would spend the rest of my life planning and taking revenge. I am no christian, forgive and forget isn't in my vocabulary, getting even is. I also believe if everyone got even, there wouldn't be repeat offenders, they would be dead or disabled.

[SandyB]

There is an article  on revenge ... I dont have it on hand .. but it has  to do  with forgiveness  . i know it all sounds high and lofty , almost as abd as the  eastern philosophy of the hollow reed  that all can  just pass through .  it may work for a bhudist  monk with no touch to real life and its tests  and tribulations..   hollow  reed does not work for me .. i am a flesh and blood being with feelings ... however the  comparison to israel / palestine / eye for eye / tooth for tooth ... Ireland  ..  war ..  retribution  upon  retribution  ... same thing  . revenge .. revenge .. revenge .. it solves nothing .. only  perpetuates ...
i go back to the Amy Bhiel story  , her  brutal  sensless murder in the townships in the early 80"s .. her parents somehow turned the whole thing around ... they managed to  forgive the perpetuators ...  where I am actually going  is  the poison of harbouring thoughts of revenge .. its poison to the soul ..  the basic premise of this  is to "forgive"  the person for the deed done   , by forgiving you do not absolve them  of the  personal  resposibilty of  their  actions and deeds  they  did  .  They have to  deal  with  that  through  normal  legal process  (justice )  , and if it so happens their conscience ,and  further  if  you  believe  so  ahve to  face  their  maker  ...  if  it so happens to come to the fore  .. by doing so  create the  abilty  to release yourself  from the  toxicity of carrying this hate load ..  Just a thought to  throw into the pool  ??

[Michael Alexander]

@Sandy  and when they show no remorse, but sit in court laughing and smiling as if the whole thing is a joke....

@Florrie, I only read the SUnday TImes for the business section and David Bullard...... I have read it for a number of years now...... and notice how things in it have changed..... David.....

[SandyB]

Perfectly understood .. I still dont knnow how Amys parents got it right ..   we are indeed primitive beings just below the surface  .. so yes revenge is actually a normal call when  one of our  own is hurt or killed ..    we can draw parralells each time .. the  laughing in court with no remorse  is indeed a valid one .. one would want to  murder  the person ...and  sadly  so  lots of  the  time  the  "system " lets  the  victims  down ..   the premise I am getting at is that  for   a person  to  be  able  to move  on with life  then  such an unusual  step  has to  be  considered or  else the memory can cripple  you   for  the  rest  of  your  life  , that  is  unless  you  got   to  secretly  extract  your  revenge/ justice  without  being  caught (  Aah !the  perfect  system )
I  know   one thing  and  that  is  that  ' the  world is round  and  anything you  do  wrong  is  going  to  come around  again  and  get  you  from  behind "  I  take  the  case  of  Uri  the  russian  he  had  quite  a   reign  of  terror  going  on  here  in  CT ..  seemed  untouchable  by  the  law  due  to  good  lawyering ..  he  got  it  eventually ..  I have  had  circumstances  where i  have  walked  away  from  something  and said  to  myself  eg :  one  guy  with  his  cruelty  to  animals .. I  challenged him  .. in  true  gangsta  style  he  challeneged back .. I  did  a  quickevaluation  of  situation .. coud  grab him  by  head  smash  his  face into  the  wall ..  result ..  retribution .. I  wouod  not  be  safe as  he  and  his   pals  would  be  after  me ... left  it  with  the  thought  of the  world is  round  was  not  easy  as i  felt  like  a  coward  at  that  moment  .. he  died a   couple of  years  later  in  an accident .. slowly  and  painfully  as  they  were  trying  to  cut him  out  of  his  wrecked  vehicle ..  2 hours  of  intense  pain  and  knowing  that his  life  was  slipping  away ... begging  .. He had  his  time  of  the  world  goes  around ... so  if  the one  system fails  then  maybe  the  other  one  of  the  divine  retribution  might do  it  sooner or  later ???  Whoo man  life  is  indeed not  easy ....we  have to make  the  calls  and hope that  they  are  the  best  at  the time ...

[georg ruf jr.]

It's all a matter of dialektic. Learning together. Being on our way.
Think of Europe after WW2. Think of Europe after the fall of the iron curtain... ect.
society only has a chance if we learn to understand and find peace with each other. Revenge let's  repeat history again and again...

[Carl Wrbka]

I think Sandy nailed it with his last post. Karma will catch up with these people sooner or later, in ways they don't expect. Call it Devine intervention if you want, somewhere out there somebody is watching, and no crime will go unpunished, whether it's in this life or the next.